I'm not off the democratize Iraq thing. Bush had no choice after
9/11, indeed, the American electorate gave him another term to
get on with his campaign against terror governments and bands
of religious terrorists. However, I now think that trickle out should commence and the Iraqi democrats be made to work harder for what they want. The emphasis should be switched from attack to training up Iraqis in secure camps ,thus, lessoning
coalition targets
Its silly to talk about 'the illegal attack on Iraq' bearing in mind
9/11 was illegal, and one of Saddams last words was Jihad, the
original meaning of Jihad was 'the spread of Islam by force'.
I personally would ban 'organised' religion, thus, making it an
individual thing

What winds most up Jobee is that we are there on a lie. A false confession of a tortured prisoner.
The war is a waste of time Jobee, you can't fight a war abroad when you've invited in and live with the enemy in this country. It's too late jobee, we've lost the war. This will be their country in a few years and the blood shed will be on our streets every day.
This country worked perfectly well with the two main religions here, Catholic and CofE. State schools were CofE end of, if you didn't like it you took your kids to another school. No ifs no buts, Cof E was the religion scholls were. NOW they're any and every religion, the fighting starts in schools, then they get this popagander from abroad, we become the enemy, an enemy that they live off.
Ban all religion from schools, or go back to Cof E or tuff sh t.

What winds most up Jobee is that we are there on a lie. A false confession of a tortured prisoner.
The war is a waste of time Jobee, you can't fight a war abroad when you've invited in and live with the enemy in this country. It's too late jobee, we've lost the war. This will be their country in a few years and the blood shed will be on our streets every day.
This country worked perfectly well with the two main religions here, Catholic and CofE. State schools were CofE end of, if you didn't like it you took your kids to another school. No ifs no buts, Cof E was the religion scholls were. NOW they're any and every religion, the fighting starts in schools, then they get this popagander from abroad, we become the enemy, an enemy that they live off.
Ban all religion from schools, or go back to Cof E or tuff sh t.

Ok Hatter, I’ll take your last line first. I would ban ‘all’ religions from school curriculum period-I would not introduce children to this god/heaven concept, a concept that leaves their minds in limbo, a concept that makes youth blow themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia and their religious masters calling them martyrs ---muckraking.

I don’t believe the war in Iraq is lost, I believe Iraq will get ‘its’ kind of democracy. I also think there will be no civil war there, Sunni’s and Shiites intermarry therefore they are closer than some governments like to portray. However, I think the coalition is still off the front foot, we should by now have stopped this stance, meaning , we should stop chasing insurgents and go into training mode, meaning, look Iraq we’ll show you a few tactical things that might help but that’s your lot, from here on in Iraq is your business.
The argument that America is after oil and nothing else is another invalid argument, resolution 1483 was signed as far back as 03

Under Secretary for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs > Bureau of Public Affairs > Press Relations Office > Press Releases (Other) > 2003 > May



Fact Sheet
Office of the Spokesman
Washington, DC
May 22, 2003

UN Security Council Resolution 1483 Lifts Sanctions on Iraq; International Community Pledges Assistance for People of Iraq

In summary, UNSCR 1483:
• Lifts the sanctions burden on the Iraqi people.
• Encourages the international community to assist in helping the Iraqi people build a better future for their country.
• Establishes the position of a UN Special Representative who will play a vital role in all aspects of Iraq’s reconstruction.
• Winds down the Oil-for-Food program (OFF) over a six-month period, while providing for the continued delivery of priority civilian goods approved and funded under OFF to meet the immediate needs of the Iraqi people.
• Supports Iraqis in charting their own political and economic future.
• Reaffirms the Coalition's commitment to work with the UN and an Iraqi Interim Administration to transition authority to an internationally recognized, representative government of Iraq as efficiently and effectively as possible.

UNSCR 1483 fulfills the promise of a vital UN role and involves the international





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The main reason I believe religion is in schools is because it's a set of rules that all knew and would be taught by all school, all teachers to all kids and they'd end up learning the same lifes rules. Thats all it is, life's rule book.
It's stopped working now because we have other religions each with their own rule book.
It's time to take the religion out of the life's rule book and make it common to all that live in this country again regardless of religion.
Only then will we be free of the riots and violence of youths today. Basic rules that they re made to realise that they WILL stick to.
Then you don't need religion, it's unneeded, defunct, useless.

Hatter, the Ten Commandments would have been enough to teach children at school.
The religions of the world ‘made a meal of it’ because governments/kings gave them concessions, even the concession of mass murder.. The Spanish Inquisition lasted from 1472 to 1830 this inquisition was started by royalty, but the Vatican with all its power could have ordered it stopped, it did not, thus , the Vatican was giving the nod to mass murder. Organised religion has failed. The proof of that failure is that we have just suffered the worst century in living memory for war and destruction, even two A bomb attacks. I would like to see ‘elected’ modern governments take all power
from these theocracies by stopping their tax concessions, thus, giving them warning,
stop your ‘daddy in the sky’ nonsense or we will finish you, and I also believe the British electorate would support that stance, just me.

Jobbee, you are going off on your anti-religion crusade again....

Time for your pill Jobee.

Ok, Ron I've taken my pill, how does this sound.

"Ron, the Ten Commandments would have been enough to teach children at school there was no need to throw the book at them".

OK, let's give Jobee a chance please, he's making an effort to debate in a reasonable manner. If you really can't stand to read his posts, put him on ignore.

Here here!

Will, as soon as someone engages in debate with him on this subject he will go off on one. putting people on ignore makes it worse, because it still shows as a new post, you just cant see what it says. I am more than happy to debate with him, but I really dont think its going to lead to anything useful. He has been warned to leave his hobby horse in the stable, yet still he keeps on. I would be delighted to have a sensible debate on faith and or religion, but I cannot see how that can happen while john is going off on one.

Thread.... hijacked

.

I believe the French are making muslims dress normally in schools-this
may water things down a bit.

Chill- let me explain, blind faith is self indulgence religion is a set of rules.
What we have been doing is throwing the book at them, what is wrong
with just teaching our children the 10 commandments. If they wish to specialise its all on computer.

So you want to strike down all religion, and then teach the Law according to one of the Gods you have just got rid of? that makes no sense. I dont think faith is blind or self indulgent. As for learning a religion from a computer, why is that any better than The Book?

Unfortunately Jobee is no longer in a position to be able to respond to this topic without losing his membership.